As I have followed the developments in the Anglican situation over the past few years, I have become aware of a number of Anglican websites that amaze me. I am amazed in that these sites endeavour to report and opine on a very difficult time in Anglicanism, but manage to do so fairly and without vitriol. This is even more amazing when they look at things Catholic, Anglo or Roman. They are seekers after truth and I have great respect for them.
Among these wonderful discoveries is the site VirtueOnline by David Virtue which headlines itself as the “voice for Global Orthodox Anglicanism.” This site posts an interesting interview with Joshua Whitfield, former Rector of St. Gregory’s, Mansfield, in the Diocese of Fort Worth. He is married and now serves as a lay assistant at St. Rita’s Roman Catholic Church, in Dallas.
This interview is fascinating and should be read in its entirety. I wish to note a few quotes that amaze me.
VOL: What made you convert?
Whitfield: Discovering the true Church. In the real sense, concrete, communal, Petrine. I’m no longer chasing after an idea of the Church should be.
VOL: When did you discover this?
Whitfield: Over the past two years; the reality has haunted me since GAFCON. I know this sounds trite, but Newman does say “be my soul the saints”, he realizes that the Church is real and you can’t construct the Church by historical investigation.
VOL: Are you saying that Anglo-Catholicism is unreal, a sort of ‘Church as Platonic Ideal’?
Whitfield: Yes. I think Anglicans are chasing something that’s unreal, an idea.
VOL: What’s wrong with GAFCON?
Whitfield: It’s Protestant. Its attitude towards the Councils and the historic Church is presumptuous. Who are Anglicans to judge?
VOL: Do you think that you’re still a priest?
Whitfield: I don’t know. I accept the living voice of the Church.
VOL: You came to believe your priestly orders were ambiguously valid?
Whitfield: Yes, irregular.
VOL: So you accept Apostolicae Curae which states that Anglican orders are null and void?
Whitfield: I do, particularly paragraphs thirty eight and thirty nine.
VOL: What do they say?
Whitfield: Pope Leo addresses Anglican clergy, saying that we clergy should be the first to make the sacrifice for unity, and that sacrifice would be honored and rewarded with great merit by both the Church, Anglicans and God.
I am amazed by the courage and conviction that it must take to accept that your orders, arguably the thing that most defines you, may not be valid and for the sake of unity to submit to the teaching of the Church. I am awe of men like this and must acknowledge that in comparison, I find my faith wanting.
Thank you also to VirtueOnline for bringing this interview to us.
December 17, 2009 at 3:40 pm
Awesome! Sometimes I wonder why C.S. Lewis couldn't figure this out.
December 17, 2009 at 3:58 pm
Ut Unum Sint!
December 17, 2009 at 4:22 pm
I went to College with Josh. I wish him well, and pray for him, but I think he is wrong. May he find peace in his new denomination (for that is all it is). God will reconcile us all. The details are not ours to worry.
December 17, 2009 at 4:44 pm
It is right to pray for Mr. Whitfield but not for the reasons you mentioned. However we should also pray for you so that you may find the Truth in Christ that is of the One God and his One Church, which aparantly relativism has made you ignore.
December 17, 2009 at 6:36 pm
All these "anglo" whosits/whatsits are simply monickers for "Protestant". That's that. However much they want to play make-believe that their "church" is historical before the 16th century is a farse, and anyone with half a brain can see it. It's sheer pride and foolishness that guides them. God bless those who have the courage to say the Emperor has no clothes.
December 17, 2009 at 6:47 pm
P. Button I think C.S. Lewis was on the right path; just ran out of time, that's all.
December 17, 2009 at 10:23 pm
Anon at 11:22, perhaps you need to make peace with your friend's new "denomination," because such a digression into derisory remarks hardly bespeaks a peaceful attitude towards it. God will sort all of us our in the end, but I do think it's best if we do as much sorting ourselves, with his help, as possible. And no, "make peace" is not a euphemism for "convert."
December 18, 2009 at 12:14 am
Virtue Online has some commenters, however, who are quite full of vitriol, especially on the homosexuality issues, and he does not censor at all. Some of his commenters drove me away. I read Stand Firm and Titus19 for Anglican news. There is also Midwest Conservative journal.
This story is great though.
It is 'Be my soul with the saints.'
Susan Peterson
December 18, 2009 at 12:18 am
Here is the citation, although I would go on farther past where this ends. (These passages had a great effect on me years ago.)
"It was difficult to make out how the Eutychians or Monophysites were heretics, unless Protestants and Anglicans were heretics also; difficult to find arguments against the Tridentine Fathers, which did not tell against the Fathers of Chalcedon; difficult to condemn the Popes of the sixteenth century, without condemning the Popes of the fifth. The drama of religion, and the combat of truth and error, were ever one and the same. The principles and proceedings of the Church now, were those of the Church then; the principles and proceedings of heretics then, were those of Protestants now. I found it so,—almost fearfully; there was an awful similitude, more awful, because so silent and unimpassioned, between the dead records of the past and the feverish chronicle of the present. The shadow of the fifth century was on the sixteenth. It was like a spirit rising from the troubled waters of the old world, with the shape and lineaments of the new. The Church then, as now, might be called peremptory and stern, resolute, overbearing, and relentless; and heretics were shifting, changeable, reserved, and deceitful, ever courting civil power, and never agreeing together, except by its aid; and the civil power was ever aiming at comprehensions, trying to put the invisible out of view, and substituting expediency for faith. What was the use of continuing the controversy, or defending my position, if, after all, I was forging arguments for Arius or Eutyches, and turning devil’s advocate against the much-enduring Athanasius and the majestic Leo? Be my soul with the Saints! and shall I lift up my hand against them?
John Henry (later Cardinal) Newman
Susan Peterson
December 18, 2009 at 12:23 am
I found a place from which to copy the rest of the passage. Starting directly after what is quoted above:
"Sooner may my right hand forget her cunning, and wither outright, as his who once stretched it out against a prophet of God! anathema to a whole crowd of Cranmers, Ridleys, Latimers, and Jewels! Perish the names of Bramhall, Ussher, Taylor, Stillingfleet, and Barrow from the face of the earth, ere I should do aught but fall at their feet in love and worship, whose image was continually before my eyes, and whose musical words were ever in my ears and on my tongue!"
All those names are "Anglican divines"-eminent Anglican clerical writers.
Susan Peterson
December 18, 2009 at 1:09 am
Susan, abortion and homosexual fanatics (once again: FANATIS) are not worth talking to IMHO. They are a lost cause and cannot be reasoned with. But as we have seen, they are pervasive and somewhat ubiquitous these days, so I wouldn't dismiss any blog just because they rear their head. However, I wouldn't bother with any Protestant blog to begin with. Just not my thing.
December 18, 2009 at 3:35 am
It was people who didn't respect the personhood of people with same sex attraction who offended me on Virtue Online. It is one thing when one's opponents are offensive; one expects it of them. But when those who are suppose to be on one's "side" make one ashamed, well, that is the situation I wanted to stay away from.
Not Protestant, Anglican. There are Protestant Anglicans, and then there are those Anglicans who go to mass, and benediction and have Corpus Christi processions, and sacramental confession. One of them catechized me when I was baptized in an Episcopal church at the age of 20. I read Newman and made my submission to Rome nine months later. But in those nine months at the beginning of my Christian life, I learned to love the language of the Book of Common Prayer, and I still feel an attachment.
Besides that, my husband attends a-very Protestant-Anglican parish, and I often attend with him (as well as going to mass or divine liturgy) so I have a current connection.
Susan Peterson
December 18, 2009 at 2:42 pm
It should be a humbling thing for the rest of us to see someone have to humble himself so to receive the same graces we have and far too often take for granted. God bless Mr. Whitfield and his family.
December 18, 2009 at 7:20 pm
+JMJ+
I became a christian at age 28 in the Episcopal church. I later converted to Catholicism at age 39. Converting to Catholicism is not an easy thing to do, given societal pressures. I am so impressed with Mr. Whitfield and his family. They must have had complete and total trust in Our Lord to do what they did, a lot of Divine Faith. He not only "changed denominations," he had to give up his livelihood. Faith and humility of this kind should be applauded and admired.
God bless you, Mr. Whitfield, and your family. You are awesome!
December 19, 2009 at 5:55 pm
Susan wrote: "those Anglicans who go to mass … sacramental confession."
The point is that they really do not, lacking valid orders. This is what really makes it so tragic: so close, and yet an Infinity away. And, to be equitable, what makes liturgical abuse in the Catholic Church such a horror. Infinity is there, but treated like a tramp in the street.
December 20, 2009 at 4:32 am
The Church is not a "denomination"; she is The Church. Denominations are a protestant thing.