Have you ever heard the phrase “nothing good can come of this?”
Well, this event is why that phrase was invented!
A retreat sponsored by the Catholic Association for Lesbian and Gay Ministry to be held at St. John’s Abbey Guesthouse in Collegeville, MN, facilitated by Bob Pileggi.
This retreat is for LGBT folks and their allies to connect to God and themselves through the body. Life has given us this great gift of a body. We can open more to God’s love, acceptance and guidance by having a fuller experience of the body; by appreciating it. Various religious teachings might tell us to deny the body in order to get closer to God; this retreat will be healing from that idea – offering us renewed love for our body, self and God. Reconnect to your body in a compassionate way; feel rejuvenation; and open to more empowered self-expression. And in the process learn some simple spiritual practices that have foundations in most of the world’s major religions (awareness, breathing, mindful movement, etc.) that you can use on your own at home and share with others.
A Catholic retreat for gay people which focuses on healing from the silly notion (silly Jesus!) of denying ourselves gratification. Ya know, ’cause active LGBT folks are notorious for self restraint. I repeat. Nothing good can come of this.
FYI
Abbey Spokesperson
Br. Paul-Vincent Niebauer OSB
320-363-2548
pniebauer@csbsju.edu
March 19, 2012 at 8:55 pm
Couldn't be further from Catholicism or any kind of Christianity. Talk about hijacking the term "Catholic"! In order to undermine Catholic faith and morality.
March 19, 2012 at 9:59 pm
"…facilitated by Bob Pileggi."
So, do we call this the "Peleggian Heresy"?
March 19, 2012 at 10:32 pm
Sounds like some of that Theology of the Body garbage, ala Christopher West, Fr. Loya, etc., mixed in with Homosexuality acceptance, empowering, blah, blah, blah.
I don't know who Bob Pileggi is, but what in the world is Catholic Association of Lesbian and Gay Ministry? Pray tell, is their mission to aid those who suffer from same-sex attraction in order to overcome it? I'm almost curious enough to go look at their website but am afraid at what I may read.
March 19, 2012 at 10:33 pm
This is just plain disgusting. Hey Bishops, Cardinals, anybody home????
March 19, 2012 at 10:58 pm
I really, truly am a devout Catholic, registered Republican, Santorum supporter, pro-life advocate, etc. I just don't think there's enough information here to make a judgement, folks. This isn't about sex or using the body in that way. It appears to be about Yoga and breathing and meditation–all of which I practice myself in the most Catholic way possible and which have helped me deal with chronic pain and deepen my prayer life immensly.
If the Church teaches us to love our gay children, why is it necessary to make such quick assumptions and be so hateful? Perhaps attending a spiritual, meditative retreat in such surroundings will help these folks feel better and bring them closer to God. Are we proposing banning from the facility because they're gay? Are you assuming they're having some kind of gay orgy? Grow up and get the mote out of your own eye.
March 19, 2012 at 11:28 pm
I know those loons up in Collegeville well. They'll read your emails, laugh really hard, feel sorry for you, and press delete.
If you want to talk to a bishop up there about it, you'd better learn to play golf.
March 19, 2012 at 11:40 pm
Ann,
Yoga is a Hindu religious practice. Ergo, practicing Yoga can be condemned by Catholics. So, what's your problem?
March 20, 2012 at 12:02 am
Nick:
The Yoga I do is strictly stretches and holding poses as a physical activity. There's no chanting or any eastern BS involved whatsoever. The few times I have practiced meditation, the class has been free to pick their own imagery on which to focus and it was silent. I chose the Eucharist.
As for this LGBT group, I think you all should check them out. As it is, if you step back and listen to yourselves, you are talking about gays as if they are lepers. This group appears to be trying to be legit. Yes, they are located in Berkeley, which doesn't help their case in my book. However, their resources are familiar publications from the Vatican, the USCCB, and others, including the Catechism. At least say, "Hey, maybe we should pray for these people" instead of spewing such bile.
Here is their ABOUT statement:
"The Catholic Association for Lesbian and Gay Ministry (CALGM) is an association of diocesan, parish and campus-based ministries and those involved in these ministries. CALGM reflects the Catholic Church's commitment to pastoral concern and support for lesbian and gay Catholics, their parents, families and friends. These ministries, under the leadership of bishops, pastors and other pastoral leaders, seek to apply Church teachings regarding the successful integration of sexuality and spirituality and the recognition of the dignity, respect and inclusion of gay and lesbian persons in the life and mission of the Church.1 As a pastoral association, CALGM focuses on connecting people with local parishes and faith communities where they can better learn about Church teaching under the immediate guidance of pastors and other trained Church leaders. For those, however, who look to us for initial guidance, we have provided links to Church documents on our RESOURCES page."
March 20, 2012 at 12:36 am
it also doesn't help they are supported by "Progressive Catholics" http://theprogressivecatholicvoice.blogspot.com/2011/02/benefit-in-support-of-calgm.html. And the Progressive Catholics love this Bishops
http://ncronline.org/news/spirituality/bishop-urges-change-church-teaching-concerning-all-sexual-relationships
I think that plus the fact that they are "healing from teachings of denying the body," make Mr. Archbolds assessment a pretty good one.
March 20, 2012 at 1:00 am
As kooky as this group may or may not be, I think its odd that you think nothing good can come of this, on the basis of finding meaning in their bodies. I mean, this runs contradictory to the whole basis of modern gender identity problems,etc. So to point to the fact that we are embodied, that are bodies are good things and tell us that God loves us so much that he made us male and female, so that we can be attracted to the other is a very good thing.
I don't say that they will go this far. But, why not pray that they do?
March 20, 2012 at 1:01 am
first are = *our
March 20, 2012 at 1:08 am
Still, the bile is unnecessary. The fact that "Our Bodies Ourselves" isn't one of their texts–that they are, in fact, using Church-published materials is reason enough to give them benefit of the doubt. Love your neighbors, people. Pray for your enemies. Count your blessings, and remember that it is lent.
March 20, 2012 at 2:05 am
Ann makes an important point. And I think it is also important to note that, based on the description, there is no reason to think this retreat caters to active homosexuals, rather than Catholics who struggle with attraction to members of the same sex. As an aside, I share an office with a gay man who was raised Catholic and let me tell you, nothing is sadder than seeing a person move away from the Church based on how he was treated in his younger days. If a person is told all their life that they don't belong in the Church, by the fact that they are gay (not because of any action) than they'll go elsewhere, and the groups they end up in are often not friendly to the Church and re-enforce the idea that the Church 'hates' them, which makes the likelihood of returning to the Church less likely. We must care about the salvation of all people. This means making an effort to show people that the Church and all Her teachings lead to the liberation that everyone desires but always struggle to find elsewhere. I have no idea what this retreat is likely to present, but I think we should point out that the issue is likely not the attendees but the what program of the retreat appears to present.
March 20, 2012 at 2:08 am
Yoga, as used in the West, is, in fact, about 50 years old. A guy in India combined one text on the spiritual aspect of exercise with some exercises done by acrobats, and marketed it to hippies as an "ancient spiritual practice".
Cut out the spiritual thing—which was tacked on in the first place—and you have a nifty exercise regimen. Although personally, I'd rather do capoeira.
March 20, 2012 at 2:25 am
señores el pecado homosexual está condenado por el mismo Dios, no es que es algo que se le ocurrió hacer a la Iglesia, y quienes lo ven y justifican el pecado también le cae a ellos, dejemonos de ser complacientes con el mundo, o se está con Cristo en en contra de Cristo, no hay termino medio, desgraciadamente debemos soportar hoy todas estas doctrinas nuevas que solo confunden a las almas y las alejan de Dios, señores estamos en epoca de apostasia y todo lo que pasa ya estaba anunciado por Nuestro Señor, solo debemos rogar y pedir que se acorten los tiempos de la venida del Señor para poner orden nuevamente. no olviden que el pecado contra natura es uno de los que claman venganza al cielo, y eso no lo podran cambiar ni siquiera la jerarquia modernista que está inquiatada hoy en la Iglesia tratando de destruirla. que Dios y la Santisima virgen nos protegan de los que están disfrazados de angel de la luz.
March 20, 2012 at 5:46 am
Ann said, "As for this LGBT group, I think you all should check them out. As it is, if you step back and listen to yourselves, you are talking about gays as if they are lepers. This group appears to be trying to be legit. Yes, they are located in Berkeley, which doesn't help their case in my book. However, their resources are familiar publications from the Vatican, the USCCB, and others, including the Catechism. At least say, "Hey, maybe we should pray for these people" instead of spewing such bile."
Ann and everyone to whom it may concern. Could we please have a moratorium (permamently) on using the word "spewing" to describe speech that we dislike. The term is so offensive that its use in and of itself could qualify as "spewing." In my opinion, it doesn't belong in any civilized discourse. Ann, I was almost on your side on this argument, but with the use of that word, you lost me. And, by the way, it was an overreaction, but that is beside my point.
March 20, 2012 at 6:03 am
Any project that identifies as "LGBT and their allies…" is not ambiguous with regards to, if you'll pardon the pun, its orientation. The appellation "gay" refers to a lifestyle that is clearly not acceptable to a Catholic. "Gay" refers, unambiguously, to a lifestyle and agenda that affirms and approves of homosexual activity, as does the term "lesbian". An authentically Catholic event would properly refer to itself with expressions like "same-sex-attraction" rather than "gay" or "lesbian".
Furthermore, it really doesn't help to quell condemnation when the "retreat's" organizers use expressions like "We can open more to God's love, acceptance (… i.e., they think God accepts their homosexual behaviour…) and guidance by having a fuller experience of the body; BY APPRECIATING IT." (sorry about the caps – I'm not yelling, just highlighting). Call me crazy, but that sounds like jargon for hedonism. "Retreat", then, might as well read "orgy".
There's no room for benefit of the doubt here. Given plenty of silly descriptions contained in the announcement (e.g., "Life has given us this great gift of a body." Wuh? I guess the cooperation of one's heterosexual parents has been substituted with the inoffensive term "life". Anything to avoid the disturbing truth.), a reasonable person would be justified in concluding that the event promotes acceptance of homosexual behaviour. Thus, the event should be condemned and cancelled.
March 20, 2012 at 11:40 am
OK, so sorry for using the word spewing. Next.
If we are to reach people who are beyond "same sex attracted" and identify as gay, then we are going to have to meet them where they live, which is in the gay community. Mother Theresa didn't wait at the convent for the poor and dying to come to her.
A certain number of gay people are full of self-hatred. If we are to LOVE OUR GAY CHILDREN as the church teaches, why should they not be taught to love themselves?
I seriously can't believe I'm even having this argument. I am the most conservative person I know. However, I also just happen to have some same-sex attracted friends that I have met through church choir. They aren't looney. They are miserable, though, and they need your prayers, not your judgements nor your hatred nor your assumptions. They aren't involved in this group–wrong part of the country–but they could be. How about we pray for them together?
March 20, 2012 at 2:05 pm
Ann,
I agree that we need to reach folks who need Christ. Mother Teresa would not have them fill out a questionnaire before having a conversation; agreed.
The question I have is: will this bring these folks who need Christ closer to Him?
This is what the facilitator means by "touch" according to his website.
* Tired from directing others all day at work and just need to be held.
* Lonely
* Feeling out of touch with your body
* a desire for connection
* a man curious about physical connection with another man
* a man in a heterosexual relationship, looking for a way to receive nurturing from another man (that we often typically wanted as a child from our father, but may not have received)
* a hope to be more comfortable with another person touching you in a safe way after some challenging physical experience
* dislike for your body and hope for appreciation of it through touch.
When I was exploring the priesthood while I was in Collegeville, a question from one of the guys exploring priesthood asked a monk about celibacy. The monk's response was this: "Celibacy only applies to sex with women."
If you think this is an isolated incident, I can tell you more. This kind of attitude about celibacy is part of the identity of this place.
This link may give you a little more detail. Warning, it's bit graphic. Click
March 20, 2012 at 2:09 pm
Ann, I agree with you in general. But I do think that this particular case doesn't warrant giving the organizers the benefit of the doubt when it comes to their respect for Church teachings. A number of other blogs have shown that the facilitator of this event works actively with groups that dissent from the Church's position, and it doesn't help the the sponsor/host of the event is a religious community with a long history of disregarding chastity in their own conduct.
Tom