As long time readers of CMR are aware, we discuss almost every thing on this blog. Almost. There is one topic not to be discussed here, until now. The M-word. Yes, Medjugorje.
Our general policy is that there is not much to be gained by discussing it as most people’s perceptions of the claims are set and dialogue between the two camps tends toward civil war. This coupled with the fact that there is little actual “news” out of Medjugorje these days leads us to the prudent decision to leave this topic alone.
But now, we actually have some news coming out of Medjugorje. Cardinal Christoph Schönborn, Archbishop of Vienna and member of the CDF spent the last five days in Medjugorje. Medjugorje supporters have steadily hinted in advance of the visit that the Cardinal coming was a tacit endorsement of Medjugorje while detractors said that is no such thing since this is merely a “private visit”.
Of course, a private visit in and of itself is no endorsement, tacit or otherwise. However, while in Medjugorje the Cardinal said Mass in the Church and gave a public speech. While careful to note that the status of Medjugorje has not changed (neither approved or disapproved) and that a final decision on the phenomena will not be reached until the alleged apparitions end, it is hard to view some of his comments as anything other than tacit (if personal) approval. Emphases mine.
“I know about Medjugorje for many years, not personally because I have never been here before, but in our Diocese and even farther, I do experience fruits of Medjugorje. I always used to say what Jesus has said in the Gospel: “You will recognise the tree by its fruits.” When I see the fruits of Medjugorje back at home I can only say that the tree is surely good.
Speaking, furthermore, about Medjugorje in the Church, the Cardinal added: “Supreme authority in the Church is the Holy See, the Holy Father and his Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, and that is the highest authority in all of the issues of faith and morality. Supreme authority of the Church gave us clear guidelines, not directly from Holy Father himself, but from Congregation on the Doctrine of the Faith that had clearly confirmed what the bishops from Yugoslavia once said, and that undoubtedly is applicable in Medjugorje. I have always repeated that. Those texts are very much known. There are three elements that are valid still today, and I can place my visit to Medjugorje within those guidelines. In that sense, my visit is not something that is unusual at all. The Holy See, in accordance with the Statement of Bishops from 1991, says the following:
“First: Non constat de supernaturalitatae. [HERE HE DESCRIBES WHAT THAT MEANS – SEE Transcript for complete text]
“Second: no official pilgrimages are to be organised, which means that I can not organise pilgrimage of my diocese to Medjugorje. That is logically related to what was mentioned in the previous point. So, there is no official recognition yet, but in that formulation it is also said that supernaturality is not excluded. The Church has clearly said it is not excluded. It is not confirmed, but it is not excluded.
“Third thing that church doctrine clearly states is also in accordance to the statement of Yugoslavian Bishops, that the faithful journeying to Medjugorje require attention and pastoral care. …
I would advise for patience. The Mother of God is so patient with us that for nearly 29 years here, in a very direct way. She is showing Her vicinity and care for the parish of Medjugorje and numerous pilgrims. We can peacefully wait and have patience! Twenty nine years is a long period of time for us, but not such a long period to our God!”
While not a ringing endorsement, it is arguably a tacit and very surprising one and I am not the only one who thinks so. Bishop Peric, Bishop of the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno, is not happy with the Cardinal. While emphasizing that his visit, in and of itself is no endorsement, he confronts the Cardinal in a direct way for what has transpired and the obvious impression it will leave with many. Bishop Peric, after listing the events and communication that led up to the Cardinal’s visit, says this:
On December 29th, the Cardinal arrived in Medjugorje. He was followed by the media over the next few days. Reports say that he gave a speech in the church of St. James the Apostle, and noting the mercy of God, said: “Who could make these things up? Who could invent this thing? Man? No, this is not a human act.” On December 31st a journalist [blogger] wrote: “While some had expected the cardinal’s visit to Medjugorje to be private, he has instead surprised the town by being very visible. He has spent his time concelebrating Mass at St James Church, climbing Apparition Hill with visionary Marija Lunetti, praying in silence at Adoration, and, perhaps most notably, giving his talk today in the parish church with the Franciscan friars at his side”
5)In all this I have to admit that I personally, as diocesan bishop of the Diocese of Mostar-Duvno, remain surprised. I understand that the Cardinal of the Holy Roman Church enjoys the right to profess and preach the Gospel throughout the Catholic Church. But with regard to public appearances outside their own diocese there also exists a certain etiquette in the Church: the bishop or cardinal who intends to come to another diocese publicly, first informs the local bishop, which is encouraged by the Church and by prudence. This understanding in the church and specific caution should be applied especially in this case.
6)I am surprised because Cardinal Schonborn’s office to the publication of this statement, no one has reported, and assuming that the Cardinal knows the position of the Church, based on the results of the commission’s research that no one can say that these are “supernatural apparitions or private revelations.” His visit to Cenacolo and with Sr. Elvira, who, by the way, as a religious nun with no permission to reside and operate in the territory of this diocese, could be interpreted as supportive. And, not only her, but a growing number of new communities and disobedient associations of the faithful in Medjugorje, which can be read as an encouragement for their ecclesiastical disobedience.
…[Here he lists his complaints about Medjugorje and the local Franciscans and then finishes]…
8)The Cardinal is excited by the many confession s in Medjugorje, where the Father’s mercy is manifested. We believe that the mercy of the heavenly Father, as reflected in Medjugorje is also in each and every parish of his diocese, both before and after the phenomenon of Medjugorje. Just look at the long lines of faithful before the confessional in all the parishes, especially for Christmas, for Easter, for holidays, or for Confirmation. Many say these confessions in Medjugorje are strong evidence that the Lady “appears”. According to this conclusion on the numbers making confessions, Our Lady would appear in all our parishes, not just those three people once a year in Medjugorje and the other three every day, in fact most outside of Medjugorje, and apparently in the cathedral in Vienna! All together now: about 40,000 “apparitions”! Indeed, one gets the impression that some “visionaries” determine where and when the Lady “comes” since the appearance happens when and where they want. Is this not an inadmissible manipulation of Our Lady and the Sacred in general?
As the diocesan bishop with this statement I want to inform the faithful that the visit of Cardinal Christoph Schonborn does not imply any recognition of the authenticity of the “apparitions” related to Medjugorje. I regret that the Cardinal, with his visit, appearance, and statements, brings something new to the present suffering of the local Church which does not contribute to peace and unity so necessary.
This episode is quite remarkable. The Cardinal’s comments and actions in and on Medjugorje are very surprising. While they are certainly nothing approaching official endorsement, they are sure to excite Medjugorje supporters and infuriate Medjugorje detractors. This is so clearly the case that Bishop Peric has publicly called out Cardinal Christoph Schönborn for his words and deeds.
Did the Cardinal really do all this without talking with Bishop Peric? Wow!
We don’t take sides on this blog on Medjugorje, but since they added mud-wrestling to the attraction, we just couldn’t stay away!
Note: Please try not to destroy the furniture here at CMR discussing this one.
January 5, 2010 at 12:28 am
We've just come through the Christmas season. Upon meditating on the Blessed Mother's role in the Incarnation, I realized that we pray in the Hail Mary "Blessed are you among women." Think about the word 'blessed.' When we think of someone as blessed, we think of them as having found favor with God. But in our culture, and even in Mary's day, we would not consider someone blessed to be in the circumstances in which Mary found herself. To be pregnant apart from marriage, even though Joseph still took her as his wife, was scandalous. It couldn't have been very comfortable for her to be surrounded by those whispering behind her back.
That's just one point. Consider then the difficulties she encountered throughout the rest of her pregnancy – the trip to Bethlehem, giving birth in a cold cave, the warning from the Magi, and leaving for a foreign country in the dead of night. Stark circumstances, indeed. Take a moment to put yourself in her place.
Consider all that and then take also into consideration that these so-called visionaries, instead of living austere lives are living high on the hog off the multitudes of people taken in by this situation. They live in mansions, drive expensive vehicles, and jet-set around the world to appear at speaking engagements. Even Mother Teresa used the expensive gifts given to her to purchase food and medicine for the poor. She kept nothing for herself.
There is so much wrong with this issue that it's impossible to disseminate it all here. Suffice to say that good can come out of evil – hence, the conversions and return to confession, etc. Keep in mind, however, that Satan can imitate piety, but he cannot imitate obedience. And that is the key to this whole thing. He's the father of disobedience and lies. That's at the bottom of this whole thing. Whether the pilgrims are regular people like you or me, or cardinals with influence, this shows that no matter what one's station in life people will toss reason and common sense out the window in favor of the sensational.
January 5, 2010 at 1:02 am
Rick,
I am glad that you are discovering Marian devotion. It is truly Catholic and bring us many graces. However, Holy Mother Church encourages us to use caution when dealing with unapproved apparitions.
The official position of the Church is the 1991 Zadar Declaration which you should read in it's entirety because in it, the local bishop retains authority over pastoral matters in Medjugorje.
Many promoters and supporters of Medjugorje will try to discredit Bishop Peric by painting everything he says with a broad brush using a statement by Cardinal Bertone with regards to his personal opinion. The Cardinal's statement was for something very specific and did not apply to the bishop's words and actions involved with the pastoral governance of Medjugorje – which Cardinal Bertone affirms in the same letter (see my post: What did Abp Bertone really say about Bishop Peric?).
Apparitions for which the Church feels may be worhty of belief would never be approved while ongoing. However, apparitions which are deemed as not supernatural, are condemned all the time, as was the case recently with "visions" associated ith Holy Love. The day the private revelations were condemned, the so-called apparition was throwing a nutty. Then went completely spastic, creating a powerpoint chart People gained attachment to it and cannot let go. This is exactly why Satan wants people to draw close to sacred things, and devotions through false apparitions – so that he can win over the souls who will say, "non serviam" and act with disobedience.
You might take a break from spending time on unapproved apparitions, and spend some time reading what teh saints say about such things. Start with St. Teresa of Avila and St. John of the Cross.
If you are going to follow any private revelation, follow some of the many which have gained full approval and present no danger of causing attachment to something which may eventually prove false.
One of the finest articles I have read on the fruits and Medjugorje, is "Medjugorje and the Flow of Grace". Do read it – there is a great deal of catechesis and theology explained therein.
Find more at my Medjugorje Documents & FAQs homepage, and at the English section of Italian professor/author, Marco Corvaglia
January 5, 2010 at 1:08 am
Oh – here is the decree on Holy Love, and followup links I meant to provide above.
Private Revelations at Holy Love condemned as not supernatural
– Condemned apparition goes spastic!
– Condemned apparition goes into grand mal seizure
So, can a decision be made on an ongoing apparition? Certainly. If a negative judgment is handed down. Prudence dictates that an approval would never come while ongoing because anything can happen to negate it while the person receiving the private revelation is still living.
Does that make sense?
January 5, 2010 at 1:19 am
Judith said: "Fr. Jozo has said, Do not be afraid to come to Medjugorje, be more afraid of not comimg."
Dear Judith,
Are you aware of the canonical status of Fr. Jozo Zovko?
Here is some useful reading. The many discinplinary actions taken by the Holy See, the Diocese, and the Religious Order does not exactly make him worthy of quoting.
– List of disciplinary actions taken against Fr. Jozo (with protocol numbers/dates)
– The trail of disobedience of Fr. Jozo Zovko (Marco Corvaglia)
You can find more about close associates of the Medjugorje seers in the sidebar of my homepage on Medjugorje Documents & FAQs and Marco Corvaglia's homepage in English (links provided in my previous post – (about 2 or 3 above this one).
January 5, 2010 at 1:19 am
Deirdre…
Interesting that you should plug Randall Sullivaan's book "The Miracle Detective."
After all, he converted to Catholicism after his experiences there as have many thousands of others including myself. Praise Be Jesus.
January 5, 2010 at 1:37 am
@Diane OCDS. Thanks for the info. The Zadar declaration stated "On the basis of studies made so far, it cannot be affirmed that these "matters concern supernatural apparitions or revelations."… and concluded " At the same time, they will continue to study all the events of Medjugorje through the commissions."
That seems to confirm that the jury's still out – like we don't know yet. And that's all that I'm saying – nothing more.
January 5, 2010 at 2:57 am
That "the jury's still out" (and it would appear that a judge has already handed down a ruling, if preliminary) should not constitute even a tacit endorsement or approval. As the Catechism would indicate, the burden of proof is on the phenomenon, not those who scrutinize it.
I once asked the late Dominican and eminent Mariologist, Father Frederick Jelly, what he thought about Medjugorje. His reply: "I wish people got just as excited over the Eucharist."
The evidence here suggests that we do not.
January 5, 2010 at 3:30 am
Excellent quote, David from Fr. Jelly.
Rick,
There are three possible decisions that can be handed down.
"it cannot be affirmed" is the second one in the list shown in my link. This means that after 29 years, there is nothing which can establish the phenomena as supernatural. This means, it is not "neutral" as some believe.
Can an approval come some years down the road? The possibility is very, very remote, especially in light of the very strong canonical case continuing to be made by the bishop.
Read carefully his three part statement just released on September 26, 2009 in which he shares heresy on the part of the "gospa" and how the seers and close associates have moved the BVM's birthday from the date celebrated by the Church to some other date.
Further, he has since released another statement – on December 17th, which goes into detail about the fiasco of the "Great Sign" or lack thereof. There are many contradictions between seers and seers/associates. The bishop shows how deceptive the whole notion of the "Great Sign" is.
The translation into English is just about complete and we should be seeing it soon.
I believe it is PAMI (international pontifical Marian academy) which is investigating Medjugorje – a panel of 30 people, which were allegedly working discretely. They were suppose to conclude their work by the end of 2009.
It just so happens that Cardinal Puljic, head of the BiH Bishop's conference had a lone audience with the Holy Father as the year closed.
It is thought that most Mariologist do not believe there is anything supernatural occuring at Medjugorje.
As I said earlier, truth cannot take a back seat to good fruits because this is relativism in practice. Nor do the ends justify the means (consequentialism). We can't excuse away or disregard the disobedience, deception, disorder and even detraction of the local bishop, for the sake of good fruits. He's also been calumniated, and physically attacked by zealots in the region who usurped one of the parishes.
As the bishop so eloquently points out, it is quite odd that the "gospa" says nothing about such things, especially the invalid Masses and other sacraments. those things may not be happening in Medjugorje, but they are just a short drive away and it is indeed odd that "gospa" does not even mention them (and when she does, she attacks the bishop).
I'm not buying it.
January 5, 2010 at 6:29 am
To those suggesting that we look at the fruits of Medjugorje, I have a simple two-fold question:
What are your thoughts on the fruits of the Legion of Christ, and do those fruits prove anything about Marcial Maciel?
The fruits are one thing to examine, not the only thing.
January 5, 2010 at 12:16 pm
Diocese of Mostar Duvno releases Bp Peric statement in English
http://cbismo.com/index.php?mod=vijest&vijest=484
January 5, 2010 at 3:12 pm
Medjugorje will go 'down hill' before the great sign on the hill and now I am glad that there is so much against this appartion, Ijust never read any before…never came acroos it…it was great…well, perfect time for Patrick to go to Medjugorje…go for your brother. And yes, I will pray my rosary every day for Patrick and Kevin. God Bless…She also said She would appear in every home if necessary…I hope and pray She comes to yours.
January 5, 2010 at 4:03 pm
MAS– you're really trying to stir up a hornets' nest, aren't you! 🙂
People keep telling me that at Medj. the good fruits outweigh the bad…
except, the idea of "The Good Outweighs the Bad" isn't CATHOLIC.
Think about it– after a lifetime of outwarsdly good works, one mortal sin can damn you.
The idea of a scale weighing the good and the bad comes from the Egyptians.
The idea that "I'm a basically good person, so it doesn't matter if I also do x," is our secular society talking.
Also, what an apparition says matters more than what it does. If an apparition says things that conflict with Church teaching, it is FALSE.
If you choose to follow the apparition under those circumstances, it's because you've chosen NOT to follow the Church.
Signs and wonders are not the same as Truth. Feelings are not the same as Truth. Even the devil can fake good feelings.
I'd suggest everyone read Fides et Ratio. You need BOTH. You can't ignore canon law and the catechism just because something gave you a good feeling.
Feelings can be WRONG. St. Therese and Mother Teresa felt like God had abandoned them. They persevered because Faith and Reason told them He had not.
Warm and fuzzy feelings of peace are, in the grand theological scheme of things, pretty worthless. Remember, the people at Jonestown felt happy and at peace too….
January 5, 2010 at 5:35 pm
Deirdre: bravo!! 🙂 Wow, I need to photocopy that in 100 ft-tall letters and plaster it somewhere where loads of people drive by it every day! (The toner cost would be a bit steep, though.)
January 5, 2010 at 6:11 pm
@David: No apparition is better than the Eucharist. Here are 5 of my personal posts about that. http://divine-ripples.blogspot.com/search/label/Eucharist
And although it is not a tacit endorsement, it is neither a tacit prohibition. It's just caveat emptor – buyer beware.
@Diane: Is this alleged apparition about a truth of the Catholic faith like a new doctrine? Let me know because I haven't heard of such. Is it just an invitation to fervour, to devotion, to commitment, to charity, to a more passionate prayer life, to zeal in the apostolate? If so, what is wrong with that?
@Matthew: Some good priests were produced by the Legionaires. It proves that God can write straight with crooked lines.
@all: I do appreciate the efforts of those who try to prevent others from being duped by false apparitions. And I shall join them if and when the Church states that Medjugorie is a hoax.
January 5, 2010 at 6:53 pm
Rick– Ugh. Not the 'crooked lines' thing again, please?
The Concentration Camps Gave us Edith Stein and Maximilian Kolbe! It proves God can draw straight with crooked lines!!
Of course, if they hadn't been killed, they would probably STILL be saints, but have had many more years to think, write, and spread the Good News….
I think that CS Lewis in Perlandrea has a good answer for this. Yes, God can turn even the Fall of Man into something beautiful (The Crucifixion and Ressurection), BUT How much better it would have been for all of us if we'd never fallen in the FIRST place.
January 5, 2010 at 7:38 pm
I too am having a jaw-droppingly good time reading Deirdre's posts. Talk about disarming!
January 5, 2010 at 7:47 pm
Thanks, guys. 🙂 Baby's been growth-spurting this week, so I'm glued to a chair more than usual!
January 5, 2010 at 8:21 pm
The authority to judge and the duty to obey.
No private individual has the authority to judge definitively and officially which private revelation are true and which are not. The authority to rule on the genuineness of a private revelation rests first with the LOCAL BISHOP. The apparitions of Lourdes, Knock, Fatima,Beauraing, Banneux- to name only a few- were approved by the LOCAL BISHOPS. The Popes of the time never issued any judgement on them…..It is forbidden, as well as sinful, to propagate private revelations which have received a negative judgement from the local Bishop, the conference of Bishops, or the Vatican's congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith.Some people say,"I'm going to follow it until the Pope says it's false".This is a useless guide for action in this matter-very rarely does the Pope make a pronouncement for or against a revelation…..Even should the local Bishop mistakenly disapprove of a genuine revelation, obedience to the Church remains paramount…..In fact, if an alleged visionary disobeys a legitimate order from the Bishop, not even God Himself would want or command a seer to spread the revelation against a lawful decree of a Bishop to desist.In fact, St.Teresa,St Margaret Mary and Sr.Josefa Menendez, where our Lord gave them a directive, but their superior forbade it, obeyed their human superior on earth.Our Lord said-"You were right to obey my representative".I love obedience and without it, no one can please me".A superior may or may not be inspired by God in his command, but you are always inspired in obeying.(Ofcourse, we're not talking about where a Superior commands sin;
Saint Padre Pio was a model of obedience.Genuine mystics never pretend to set Christ against His Church.You are free to disagree with the Bishop, but you owe him practical obedience, meaning not to propogate a revelation that the Bishop has judged negatively. Read the whole artice at http://www.christianorder.com/features/features_2004/features_oct04.html
There is ALOT of disobedience at Medj.The Local Bishop has sited it in his letter.
January 5, 2010 at 9:45 pm
"No apparition is better than the Eucharist … And although it is not a tacit endorsement, it is neither a tacit prohibition. It's just caveat emptor – buyer beware."
The remarks of John of the Cross, not to mention the behavior of the great mystics as described in the comment posted at 3:21 PM, would suggest a response closer to avoidance than mere caution. And if "no apparition is better than the Eucharist," why would one be any more inclined to visit even Fatima, than Sunday Mass?
January 5, 2010 at 10:02 pm
@David: "And if "no apparition is better than the Eucharist," why would one be any more inclined to visit even Fatima, than Sunday Mass?"
My guess is that the Eucharist has become commonplace and familiarity has bred contempt. Without constant prayer, recollection and reflection, one would fail to appreciate the miraculous reality of the Lord's presence there. The wonder is obscured by the noise, dissipations and distractions. Apparitions on the other hand present a novelty that is naturally enticing, kind of a circus to those who are less devout. Then again, perhaps that is the idea – to lead to faith those who are without faith.
Finally, I think that those who bother to trek that pilgrimage also appreciate the great gift of the Eucharist. It would be interesting to do a survey and calculate that correlation. Intuitively though, who would go to Medjogorie when they can tour London or Paris?